[Hwdb-devel] Re: debian hwdb

[Zenaan Harkness]

On Fri, 2004-06-11 at 00:36, Martin Michlmayr wrote:
> * Zenaan Harkness <zen@freedbms.net> [2004-06-10 17:26]:
> > So: what I would like to see, *that*will*be*better*for*DEBIAN in the
> > long run, is a kernel-, os- and distro- neutral database for Free
> > software projects.
> 
> Before I suggested doing our own hwdb, I looked around to see if there
> are (generic) hardware databases already to which we could add Debian
> specific content.  Unfortunately, nothing seemed up to date and
> maintained.  I agree that having a big DB with all info would be nice,
> but I wonder how much more effort this would be.

(Following Martin's lead by doing reply-all here - hope that's OK.)

As per my earlier -devel emails:
---
           From: 
Zenaan Harkness
<zen@freedbms.net>
             To: 
linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
             Cc: 
debian-devel@lists.debian.org <debian-devel@lists.debian.org>
        Subject: 
[Fwd: Re: drivers
DB and id/ info
registration]
           Date: 
Wed, 26 May 2004
15:08:13 +1000

I think we need to somehow make it easy for manufacturers to submit
information about their hardware - something centralized, kernel- and
distro- neutral, that can be widely advertised to manufacturers.

Here is what I've found so far for id DBs, and it seems a bit all over
the place:

PCI
==============================
http://pciids.sourceforge.net/

Which has a submit new entry form, which asks for ID, Name, Comment and
Email only, here:
http://pciids.sourceforge.net/iii/?sub=1

Printers
==============================
http://www.linuxprinting.org/kpfeifle/LinuxKongress2002/Tutorial/VIII.Foomatic-Contribution/VIII.tutorial-handout-foomatic-contribution.html
Which has a forum for submission, and a list of information to
describe the printer, seems aimed at users:
      * Manufacturer's name
      * Model name
      * Mechanism type (as laser, inkjet, dot matrix, ...)
      * Color or black-and-white?
      * Maximum resolution claimed by the manufacturer and obtained by
        you with free software
      * Connection types (Parallel, USB, Ethernet, ...)
      * Maximum paper size
      * Special functionality (multi-function device, finishers, ...)
      * Type of consumables/refills (as "one black and one color
        cartridge", "toner/drum unit", ... not only "cartridge(s)")
      * How did you get it to work? Which driver(s) did you use and with
        which option settings? Which driver do you recommend? Did you
        apply special tricks (as hacking the driver's code, using an
        additional filter, ...) to get the printer to work?
      * Also reporting that a printer does not work at all is important
        for us, users should be warned before they buy a "Paperweight".
      * What is your impression of the results? Categorize your printer
        in one of the levels described on the database introduction page
        (http://www.linuxprinting.org/database.html).
Also has suggestions to manufacturers further below.

USB
==============================
http://www.linux-usb.org/usb.ids
http://www.linux-usb.org/
Various links, mailing lists, a working devices list, etc.
Also a link to Linux USB Guide:
http://www.linux-usb.org/USB-guide/book1.html
No clear submission for manufacturers.

Firewire
==============================
Can't readily find anything with google.

=========
So, does it make sense to create a centralized repository, and/ or an
FAQ for manufacturers.

I really think it needs to be easy for manufacturers to supply
information. I have no doubt that there must be a standardized process
at MS whereby manufacturers can submit device, id, name and other driver
information directly to microsoft and have it included in the next
service pack. I'm guessing here though, but it does seem like we in the
free software community are playing catch up, and that that is in some
way simply an organizational problem.

All thoughts, suggestions, further links to add to the above list, etc,
very much appreciated.
---
Other email reply snippets:

Have you seen "Mandrakelinux hardware support" ?
http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/hardware.php3

---
> Firewire
> ==============================
> Can't readily find anything with google.

There is a Hardware Compatibility list on http://linux1394.org that
allows you 
to add devices ( http://linux1394.org/hcl.php ).

---

If anyone has more - eg. distro hw support info email contacts is ideal
here, please contribute.

---

Now given that Red Hat, SUSE and other 'big' distros have their own HW
compat db lists, and the above lists, I feel there is plenty to go on to
get the communication happing and get some unification happening.

Key features in my mind:
 - possibility for automatic ID/ hw info submission to the DB (so that
users can play as much as possible a part, even without necessarily
having to go out of their way to do so)
 - simple, obvious, clean and intuitive interface for manufacturers (I
really think this is the big missing link - the whole "single point of
contact" thing I mentioned previously)
 - vendor-, or-, kernel-, etc- neutral (in other words, we include all
information about every kernel and distro that users/ developers/
manufacturers care to include)

I think step one is to compile a list of key contacts, and start
contacting them. I will do this slowly myself (have big deadline over
next 6 weeks at work though...) if needed - I really believe this is the
only practical solution, even for a specific distro (practical in terms
of getting better and more comprehensive *and*up*to*date information on
specific hw support).

I actually think that hw support will mostly relate to kernel support.
For the distros the question then becomes if they are currently
packaging the latest/ appropriate kernel or kernel patches, and/ or the
appropriate support libraries/ utilities/ GUIs for this particular
hardware.

---

Free Software Hardware DB Information Categories:
 - device/ hardware
 - manufacturer
 - kernel
 - driver
 - libraries
 - support utilities
 - distros
 - suppliers

---

cheers
zen